[itsonlyme]

Well, it happens that I'm a maker of a new feature that will allow browsing users' shared files using a friendly tree, with the directory structure and stuff.

I even released some screenshots of the feature (it will be released shortly in SlugFiller-itsonlyme mod) and I have to say I had a really hard time testing it - almost nobody lets others see their share!

I'm wondering why is that, and so I created this poll.

I would like you to honestly answer the poll question and think about your answer.

Also, if your answer is that you're afraid of organisations busting people for copyrighted material, I'd like you to think for a moment... Aren't you afraid they'll simply download a copyrighted file from you? It's a lot easier than browsing each users' files - you can bust 10s or even 100s of people at one time! And if you think they won't download it, because they're banned - they're also banned from browsing your files... So, are you still afraid?

I'm expecting that as an effect on the ensuing discussion a few people at least will change their seeShare permissions.
Please.
Such great feature can't go to waste!


PS. Note to moderators. Please don't move it to "another RIAA" thread, although there may be some talk related to it. Please.

This post has been edited by itsonlyme: 05 October 2003 - 08:37 PM

[Krurst]

yes they can bust 1000's of people at one time, but for only one count. Look what they did for kazaa - they got the users shared file list then sued them for 1000's of counts of copyright violation.
To be honest, the only time I've wanted to see a users file list was when I was getting mad speeds of them.

[hypnotoad]

I agree with the last post...i have no interest in viewing other users shared files

unless I get good speeds from them.......I do show my shared files, but I have a

low id so i very rarely get people taking them from me....

[lordpake]

I let others see my shared files. I've actually made some incredible discoveries while browsing other people's files (i.e. stuff i didn't know exists/I forgot to dl year ago etc. just to give a few examples)...

[jelsoft]

It's too dangerous.

The MPAA and other organizations are scanning the eDonkey network for copyright material.

As of now these organizations can only scan one file at a time for a user.

If the user list is open and lot of file is being shared this will attract the attention of the MPAA and co.

There is already an search engine in eMule which allows you to gather all the sources.

itsonlyme, by making this program I hope you realize that you are doing the dirty work for the MPAA and other corporations.

This post has been edited by jelsoft: 08 October 2003 - 05:35 PM

[Stregone]

They don't need to scan your shared files, they can just scan all of the various ed2k link sites and add all of the files they find to their modded emule. It will then find everyone who is sharing all of the files, no need to sort through crap they don't care about.

[itsonlyme]

They can't prove that the file name Matr*x Rel*aded, that you have in your shared list, is indeed what its name says.
They have to get the hash of that one and download at least one chunk of that file from YOU.
To do that, they would have to start a download.
They don't need to browse your files to do that.
They just download from you.
Do not think that you filter them with the great IP Filter feature.

And a PS.
Didn't you know I'm their secret spy?

[SlugFiller]

For the record, I share some non-copyright stuff I'd rather people not see(or download, for that matter, but it would be too much work to unshare it), but I still let people view my entire shared files list.

[wistily]

Actually, it's not very hard for evil forces to know who is sharing what.

-Hello dear server, who is sharing the file xxxx.avi ?
-Hello master, here are the ips:.....

But, with that method, you have to cross reference your records to get the real shared list of each user. It's much harder than just requesting it. By requesting it, you can also immediatly know who are the big sharers.

Quote

They can't prove that the file name Matr*x Rel*aded, that you have in your shared list, is indeed what its name says.

They don't have to prove anything. They just have to get the biggers advocates, and you will loose.

Also in emule network, what would really be the interest of seeing the shares ? It's interesting with napster and all other p2p where you download only from one source.

[M.e.D.]

i let friends.... why because i KNOW i can trust them.....

i wouldnt mind allowing others to see XXX of my share... (files that are going to be kept shared or rare files) i would also like to see some sorta show XXX files to comunity or even share XXX files to comunity YYY only.....

also the RIAA the MPAA and all the other 4 letter acronims scare me

M.e.D.

[Ruri]

Refusing to reveal your share doesn't protect you at all. What the RIAA does is write special programs that try to download as many of their copyrighted songs as possible, then automatically turn this into a database and report the ones who are sharing the most of the copyrighted files they were sampling. They just grab that list and send it to their lawers.

You don't really think they have some guy sitting there requesting your shares or trying to guess what you have, do you? That would take ages! They write special programs to do it for them (Kazaa's company actually tried to sue them for copyright violation in writing those programs ), and they use downloads as a measurement, not undependable and difficult-to-search reports from the users.

Long story short, if you're sharing any copyrighted song, the RIAA can learn about it easily. The only thing you can do to stop them or slow them down at all is to stop sharing that file; refusing to reveal your share is no more effective then covering your monitor in garlic or nailing a cross to it and asking Baby Jesus to protect you. The risk is very small, of course, and at the moment only present with popular music that the RIAA seems to be defending, so don't freak out; but if you can't take that risk then your only option is to leave the game.

This post has been edited by Ruri: 09 October 2003 - 01:35 AM

[krusty]

i think it would be a good idea to add an icon, to clients who have this option on. so i can click on this clients and send a request for shared files. i know that the plus mod's have this option on as default. so i can search for users having the plus mod name. but the other clients?

[jelsoft]

Not sharing your file list means less trouble for yourself.

For example, if you are sharing:

Laxtrix.avi
Mare Wars.avi
Fatman.avi

If the studios are searching for users with Laxtrix.avi files, in theory you would only get in trouble for that particular file, not the other files.

It's like if the police caught you with a bottle of beer while driving. You have a case of beer in the car and the police only finds that one bottle, then you will only be charged for that one bottle not the case of beer. Of course if you show the police the whole case of beer, then you will get yourself into more trouble.

Not sharing your file list doesn't mean you won't get caught, it just means there is less damage to yourself.

[lonecat]

I agree with lordpake, that is why I like to see the shared files. I share my list with "friends". If I've downloaded alot from them or see their names alot on files I'm downloading, I figure they will have things I will like, don't know about or fogot.

[Ruri]

jelsoft, I don't think you understand how the RIAA searches work. They don't have some guy sitting behind a computer all day checking thousands of computers; they have special programs that do searches and downloads for all the copyrighted files they want to protect, then automatically compile these results to report who is sharing the most copyrighted items.

To use your example, if you were sharing:

Laxtrix.avi
Mare Wars.avi
Fatman.avi

...and the studios were interested in suing people over Mare Wars.avi and Fatman.avi, they would also be searching for and attempting to download those two files. You would only be in trouble if/when their searches turned up all three, as well as enough other files (which you can't prevent as long as you're sharing them publically). At that point then they'd just take the list of the violating files their searches found and sue you with that. They never need to see your share; they'll already know about all the files they care about. Going over the share-list to check if each file happens to be copyrighted is inefficent when they can use searches and downloads to reliably check each file everywhere.

This way of doing things also lets them easily verify if you the file you have is actually in violation of their copyright and not just misnamed/confused; all they have to do is check a downloaded file once, and everyone who shares the file with that hashset will have been implicated.

[Mirkwood]

It is a pity that people don't allow to view their shared files.

Here are two benefits:
1) If you allow to see people to see the files you share, they know what you are downloading, therefore they can decide to make that file available to you so you gain an additional source and it allows this source to get more credit with you
2) It allows one to see what files are like by people that download the same file. (similar like the amazon feature)

[AchtungAffen]

I let everyone see my shares. I think it not only as a moral obligation, but also as something necessary for the wellfare of the community. The problem is that I have so many shared files that it takes ages to pass the info. But anyways, I still let everyone see my shares.

[zaNDaDoUm]

Ruri, on Oct 11 2003, 07:24 PM, said:

jelsoft, I don't think you understand how the RIAA searches work. They don't have some guy sitting behind a computer all day checking thousands of computers; they have special programs that do searches and downloads for all the copyrighted files they want to protect, then automatically compile these results to report who is sharing the most copyrighted items.

oh man... you guys make me laught so much everytime I read that crap... how do you know so well how riaa works? NO ONE KNOWS, YOU GUYS ONLY SUPPOSE THEY DO THIS OR THAT. Of course it is more logical to have loggin programs and not a person checking shared-lists, but how can you all presume to be so sure about how a company works you didn't even know how much employees they have? You know NOTHING about them and presume to know it all.

This goes for EVERYBODY HERE, not only you.

PS: even if they use loggin bots or whatever programs, a HUMAN has to take a look to that logs...

oh by the way: I don't show my shares:

1) because I believe that sending my shared list causes more overheat
2) I don't want other to see what kind of stuff I download
3) you will like it or not, but it makes riaa a little bit more difficult (see kazaa)

[Ray_Parlour]

People should hack into RIAA and delete all their programs and snooper software. That way Cary Sherman and co. are going to be humiliated. Otherwise sharing files is dangerous.

[-Mac-]

My shared list is visible to everyone, I'm a bit of a loner so I only have one friend on emule

I am trying to not download or upload anything illegal, so it serves as a little reminder that what I have isn't private. I'm not ashamed of my porn collection either, so why do I care if you go browsing it all sweaty palmed